SMART KITCHENS

Taking a nod from commercial chefs, award-winning Katerina Vastardis, co-owner of Designs by KS, explores how smart kitchen design can impact efficiencies and the wellness of your family too.

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Co-Host: Mike Freedman, owner,  AI Technology & Design
Co-Host, podcast editor: Jennifer-Lee Gunson: jPod Creations
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Distributed by Buzzsprout

Katerina Vastardis

With over 15 years of experience in the design and renovation industry, Katerina and her partner Silvie create life-changing experiences through well-designed spaces and with their proven process, will turn your vision into fruition. Working in all areas of the Lower Mainland, packages for design, supply, and project managing services allows the team to tailor to the needs of each specific project.

Niky Furtado

Like his father, Niky’s passion for building and design started at the young age of 12 when he assisted his father in many of his renovation projects. His passion for mechanics and building led him to success within the field. He received an Architectural Structural Drafting diploma and completed part 1 of Heavy Duty Mechanics, which were both attained through BCIT. Niky is now putting his focus on gaining more insight and knowledge towards building his skills in the renovation and construction industry. His precision and meticulousness make him a valuable asset and great addition to the Furtado Contracting team. In his spare time, as a member of the Westwood Motorcycle Racing Club, you can find him at the Mission Raceway Park making his way through the track.

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Jennifer-Lee:

Welcome to Measure Twice, Cut Once, the podcast from HAVAN, the Homebuilders Association Vancouver,

Mike:

It’s Season Three, and we’re exploring how our homes can improve our wellbeing.

Jennifer-Lee:

We’ll be looking at the impact of the air we breathe,

Mike:

The water we drink and

Jennifer-Lee:

The acoustic levels in our homes,

Mike:

Smart kitchens,

Jennifer-Lee:

Award winning designs,

Mike:

And leading-edge building construction.

Jennifer-Lee:

We ask the questions.

Mike:

So, you know how to make your home work for you.

Jennifer-Lee:

I’m Jennifer Lee Gunson.

Mike:

And I’m Mike Friedman. Now that you hear why not hit subscribe and you’ll never miss an episode.

Jennifer-Lee:

Hey, Mike, it’s Measured Twice, Cut Once day.

Mike:

Yes, it is Jennifer-Lee. And it’s always a great day when we get to come into the studio and record this podcast, we get to see our industry friends hear the latest industry trends and of course, quality time with Mike and Jen.

Jennifer-Lee:

Yes. And its award season making it extra special as we get to speak with award-winning builders and designers like today’s guest Katrina co-owner of Designs by KS and Niki Furtado co-owner with his father, Furtado Contracting. I believe they’re up for several Georgia Awards and HAVAN Awards.

Mike:

Yeah. And I’m absolutely interested in today’s topic, smart kitchens. You know, how much I love to cook, and Designs by KS have their roots in kitchen design.

Jennifer-Lee:

And I believe Katrina has a personal passion for cooking and family gatherings too. She does make a good spread. I’ve been to her home.

Mike:

<laugh> All right. Well, let’s bring on our guests and get the scoop on smart kitchens.

Jennifer-Lee:

Welcome Katrina and Niki.

Katerina:

Thank you. Thanks for having us.

Jennifer-Lee:

Yeah, I’m really excited to, I get to interview people in the last few episodes I’ve known for quite a while. Katarina. I’ve known you for a while and through HAVAN, and I’m just excited to sit down with you and talk today. And Niki, I get to meet you for the first time. So that’s great. So, Katrina let’s let everyone know about you. How did you start Designs by KS?

Katerina:

Yeah, so my partner and I Sylvie started our little business about almost six years ago now. We were lucky enough to be working together for four years before that. So, I often talk about how we got to date as partners before actually becoming partners is what I’m saying. So, Designs by KS has been around for five years. We specialize in residential homes, and interior design. We do have a focus towards kitchens, bathrooms, and just generally the living spaces that you spend most time with our overall mission is to improve people’s lives and spaces and create new memories for them.

Mike:

Sounds like both of you have a background in food and cooking and kitchens. Can you talk a little bit more about that and what led you to this path?

Katerina:

We have quite a similar background in the sense of we’re both of Greek origin descent, I was born in Greece actually, so we have bigger families. We love to entertain. We both love to cook. Sylvie’s parents own a diner in Kitsilano that’s been around for like 30 plus years. So, she grew up in the restaurant business. And then I kind of came from a little bit of a similar background where my mom was running pizza places like a franchise in the past. And, you know, I was in the restaurant business for a few years, putting myself through school. So not only do we love the entertainment and the home and cooking for guests, but we also have this appreciation of the kitchen from a commercial side that I think brings a unique aspect into that specific space.

Mike:

Does it differ designing for a commercial kitchen versus a home kitchen? And what are some of the things you scale from a commercial environment and to make it better for us to operate in our own homes?

Katerina:

Yeah, I mean, there is a difference, definitely one’s meant to, you know, serve a lot more meals than the residential kitchen, but there’s a lot to be learned and taken from the commercial kitchen. The efficiency of that working space is next level in comparison to the residential space. So, there’s definitely things that we try to tap into and bring them into our homes.

Jennifer-Lee:

And Niki, tell us a little bit more about Furtado Contracting. You work with your father. I also work with my family construction business, so I’m sure we can share a lot of stories. My dad always told me never to get into construction. I don’t know about yours.

Niky:

Basically, ever since I was young, I had some strong role models in my life, like my father and my grandfather, and both of them were always in the workshop building new inventions for the home and also for just everything in general. So, I mean, it was kind of given that I was going be going into the industry one day and I mean, it’s kind of just in my DNA, <laugh> really, but we ended up establishing the company in 2009. We’re a small family business. My father has been in the construction industry for over 30 years, and he holds a civil and structural drafting diploma as well. I hold a structural drafting diploma from B C I T. And this really helps us in understanding the building envelope and being able to easily communicate changes that arise during projects. And then, you know, I’ve literally started from the bottom. So, I’ve done sweeping, I’ve done demoing, framing, drywalling, tiling, you name it all the way to delivering the final product.

Jennifer-Lee:

It sounds like that’s how every kid starts on the job site. <laugh> my brother too, pushing a broom at 12.

Niky:

Yep, exactly. Someone’s got to clean that job site for them.

Jennifer-Lee:

Somebody does. And I did find out too that you like motorcycle racing. Can you tell us a little bit about that?

Niky:

I’ve always had a passion just for anything that is either working with my hands or just being mechanically inclined. So, I’ve always naturally been drawn towards cars and motorcycles, but I’ve wanted to do car racing, but that’s extremely expensive. So, I found a way to make it cheaper by knocking off two wheels.

Mike:

Awesome. Well, one of the reasons we’re so excited to talk to you guys this week, and me specifically is I spent a lot of time to talking about smart homes as an entire encompassing thing. We don’t really talk about the sums of what a smart home is, but definitely the kitchen being the heart of the home should be part of the conversation. So, let’s start by having you guys talk to us about what is a smart kitchen.

Niky:

A smart kitchen is actually quite a few things, but from the technological side, I view it as a kitchen that has a central hub, whether that being a Google eco nest or an Amazon Alexa, or just an app that you can control from your smartphone that essentially communicates with all your appliances, whether it be your stove top, your hood fan, and being able to communicate. So, like you turn on your stove, your hood fan comes on, right. Instead of being like cooking and remembering that, I forgot turn on, you know, so definitely something like that or having a refrigerator as well, that has a sensor in it that tells you when your products are expiring, are coming close to expiring or having a camera built into it as well, to be able to view what you have, if you’re at the grocery store and you’ve forgotten your checklist, which is something to have capability to make a unison flow between all your appliances, really, but much more than just that though.

Jennifer-Lee:

I was watching a lot of YouTube videos on smart kitchens yesterday, but they were saying one of the biggest hindrances is getting all your appliances talking to each other because when you’re using different brands, because maybe you have a different price point, they said it’s difficult because not all of them work from one central hub at the moment. And because technology is ever changing, and new things are coming up all the time. So, what would be your best piece of advice for somebody that wants to start doing this type of thing and implementing smart items into their kitchen?

Niky:

In that sense, like one of the things too is if you had just like a convention oven with a stovetop as well, like a range that would not be compatible with a certain hood fan. So when you’re going to the store and you’re picking out your appliances from the very start it’s about trying to find which appliances would be able to communicate better, but then also doing research on which system you would prefer to have in your home that is more capable to be used in a wider range of appliances. So just doing, doing research beforehand and seeing what system you would prefer to use in your home, or which system you already have, that appliances are compatible with.

Jennifer-Lee:

And when you sell your home, say you’ve created a smart kitchen because everybody is a different user. Like I know I’m an Android user and some people are Apple users. Is it hard for resale value? If people purchasing that kitchen are maybe not in tune with whatever you’re using to guide all the appliances.

Niky:

If you’re using like Google Nest, Pro Hub kind of thing, then that is kind of like universal in a sense, because your Pro Hub is one that connects, but from an app standpoint, most apps are compatible with your running operating system. So, if you have an Android or an iOS or whatnot, you would be able to, but you know, it’s, trying to find which ones.

Mike:

Yeah. And there’s a lot of great software out there that are designed specifically as control options to get different brands to work together as well. There’s the technology put in the kitchen that makes it smart, but there’s also some thought that goes into it to make it smart as well. Can you guys talk about smart design of the kitchen and how that factors into creating a smart kitchen versus a traditional kitchen?

Katerina:

I think that the way that we think about space planning in the kitchen is very important and there should be a huge focus on that. That makes the space that you’re working in efficient. So, space planning, I would say would be, you know, a key point. And from there there’s key items like appliances that you can consider, like Niky was just touching on, they’re getting smarter themselves. They should be the right fit, both appliances in all materials. And the layout that you’re working on should be the right fit for your family and your home. That makes a space smarter to use and more efficient. And there’s plumbing fixtures. There’s just like different types of countertops and all these different types of materials to consider that will bring further efficiency into the space.

Mike:

And I really enjoyed, you were telling me about your dishwashers, how they factored your decision as well. Can you talk a little about why you did what you did in your, your kitchen?

Katerina:

Yeah. I feel like I’m going to say this a few times today. I had the opportunity to do something in my own home when designing it and I built it from scratch with, Furtado Contracting, but I got to implement some of these ideas that I talked to clients about and not necessarily everybody’s going go for this idea of having two dishwashers, but for me it was very important that a dishwasher is something that works hard. I don’t want to be doing all the dishes myself. So automatically you get one dishwasher. I decided to do a second dishwasher, which is technically a half dishwasher. It’s a dishwasher drawer. And that overall takes when we’re entertaining, it’s doing the extra wine glasses, it’s doing the extra cups, some plates that overflow that the first dishwasher was not going to do in one run. So that’s very important to me.

Katerina:

Also, there’s like little points that if you’re a young family with a baby, that secondary dishwasher that can just sanitize bottles and all the kids’ stuff separately from what you’re using throughout your home. And I was also going to mention that in my particular layout, I have a gal ley-style kitchen. So, my sink is on my island, and I pretty much decided to purchase a very expensive drying rack because you do hand washing pots pans or delicate like wine glasses and so on. And the natural place to find them to dry is on your countertop. Well, that doesn’t look good when your sink is on the island. I know that’s most commonly what people do, but since I’m not entertaining every day, that second dishwasher is my clean dishwasher. So then when I’m hand washing, everything goes in there to dry and it’s not sitting on a mat on my countertop.

Jennifer-Lee:

So, you already mentioned that you chose a galley-style kitchen. So how did you decide to go with that certain plan? That that would be the one that would work for you and your family?

Katerina:

It goes back to the idea of bringing in the commercial restaurant, the commercial kitchen, into my home, knowing the efficiency behind it. So, you often see a galley-style kitchen, especially in very small restaurants. You’ll see like essentially two benches, the cooking side and then the washing side or prep side. I decided to base it around that it made for efficiency as to how I rotate between my two working stations, being cooking, and then cleaning. So, on the backside I have my cooktop and then within a step or so I think it’s really one step within a rotation I get to turn around and be at my sink and use that counterspace either of it or the sink itself. So that efficiency I think was picked up from the commercial kitchen space. And with that being said, I also wanted to bring it back. There’s a lot of light, especially in the past little while on a working triangle in the kitchen. Now I find that a little bit overrated. If we just think away from this triangle, because it is putting borders into that layout. Overall, I think you should be thinking about the working stations. You can have your refrigeration station all in one wall and it doesn’t fall within this triangle, but then you have your cooking station and then your cleaning station. They don’t have to be all in line within a triangle space.

Mike:

We talked a little about appliances and I want to go back to appliances because there’s so much conversation around appliances. Number one, the major appliances and number two, the increase in the number of small appliances we all have to deal with. Let’s start with large appliances versus small appliances. The challenges always cost versus space. And how does one make a decision to which pieces they’re going to have in their house? And why can you guys talk a little bit more about that? So, once you’ve designed the layout of the kitchen, what actually goes in there and how do you make space for it?

Katerina:

I think the big conversation actually may start with the appliances before you even design the layout. In my particular space, I knew that I wanted an X amount more of appliance than the average home. So that was taken into consideration even when we go back to the galley versus an L-shaped kitchen, those things, because appliances are big, and they take up space. Those things were taken into consideration upfront. And because there’s a certain price point to them, appliances can be from, you know, a very low budget to half your budget entirely for either your renovation or the space itself. So, focusing in on the appliances starts to set your budget as well. It also sets up your space for functionality and storage.

Jennifer-Lee:

And when you’re designing, obviously there’s the fixed appliances, but do you ever count the small appliances? Because a lot of people like to bring in everything from there, I heard air friers are a big thing now.

Katerina:

<laugh> These small appliances. I think they’re not a trend. They’re here to stay. Whatever the trend may be about the air fryer or your rice cooker. These small appliances are meant to make life easier and more convenient. We’re on the go all the time and we live busy lives, but at the end of the day, we’re healthy and we want to have home cooked meals and these small appliances make for convenience when it comes to cooking. So, we now are taking more so in consideration all these small appliances and where they’re stored and how efficiently you can get to them. I have an example of, you know, for years I would try to pitch to my clients an appliance garage. Now we did see it in probably like the late eighties and nineties and it actually look like a garage door. We’ve modernized that it doesn’t look like a garage door, but it does sit on your countertop, and it has the opportunity to have a cabinet door on it. And you close off these appliances from showing on the day to day, but perhaps your countertop is running right through that area. So, you can drag out your rice cooker, that’s actually heavy or your, mixer and so on for easy convenience, you pull it out, you use it. We also put outlets inside that cabinet space as well. So, if you wanted to, you can keep your coffee maker running all the time inside that space and just close off that door or keep it open.

Jennifer-Lee:

That’s cool. I remember having appliance garage while growing up <laugh> with the door that would go all the way up and down.

Katerina:

Yeah. You know, what’s actually funny about that. I was saying earlier that I’ve tried to pitch it for years and finally people are coming towards the light because they’re seeing how many small appliances we have, but the toss up is how much counter space you have. And then I’m trying to take away that counter space to give it to the appliance garage. And people are like, oh, whoa, whoa, whoa. But I need counter space. And then I tell them that I think it’s counterproductive.

Katerina:

<laugh> I was working on that.

Katerina:

So, and the point being is that those items are going to stay somewhere. They’re going to be stored somewhere and you’re going to end up putting them on your countertop to use them. So, there’s a beauty and just covering it all up at the end of the day. So that area looks clean and minimalistic as well. We’re living in smaller spaces. So, you don’t want the space to look so crowded and back to my galley kitchen. Well, I don’t want appliances on my island. The island is always on display because it’s not hanging on a wall. So, to have my coffee maker or my toaster just out there every day, doesn’t seem ideal to me.

Mike:

What are you doing in the way of energy management for these appliances? We have numerous appliances plugged into our home. We know that most things are drawing about 25% of the power on standbys and full operational mode. You look at eight devices, that’s certainly a lot of draw. How are you guys managing that?

Katerina:

So even on the, I mean there’s a lot to be said, but I’m going to keep going on my appliance garage idea. So, I said that you can leave an outlet inside that space, right? You can plug in your items. So, in order for that to pass inspection, that outlet needs to be switched off when the door closes off. And so, the there’s a little sensor switch on the case of the cabinet or on the door. I’m not sure it’s on the case, right, Niky. Yep. so, when that door closes, the energy is shut off from the outlet, which is pretty cool because at that point you don’t need those appliances. They’re not running behind that closed door. They shouldn’t be running. Your toasters should not be running behind there. But it’s shutting off the power in that area itself as well. So, when you’re done with your area, you close the door, you didn’t have to sit there and unplug your three to six appliances that it may have fit in there.

Niky:

When you leave your appliances plugged in, like you were saying, they draw 25%, but that adds up to 10% of your energy bill every, every month. So, a way to mitigate that and to try and keep those, those vampire or Phantom powers down is to install smart outlets instead. So one thing to keep in mind when doing your smart outlets, like, yeah, you can do it after, you know, after you’ve had a renovation or whatnot, you know, it’s been down the road and you’re trying to mitigate your hour, but it’s also better to kind of think about this beforehand, because what you can do is if we have everything lined up beforehand with a designer and, and us, what we can do is we can plan what a small appliances you’ll have a longer countertop and then we can run those smart outlets in line with one another or down downfall of one another to be able to be mitigated from the app on your phone. So, you can leave on your coffee maker if you wanted to, cuz you need it to wake up in the morning or you can have it turn off your other appliances that are connected in line with that.

Mike:

I just have one question. It may seem like a ridiculous question. When I was a kid, the microwave went in a cupboard, then it went over the stove and now it’s back in the countertop. How are people dealing with microwaves these days? So, we know what the latest trends are in terms of how to manage that.

Katerina:

I would say that they’re entirely walking away from microwaves, perhaps <laugh>, there’s been a shift where the microwave is not as popular, although practical. So, I totally understand. I don’t have a microwave in my home. I’ve switched to a steam oven. It does almost everything that the microwave does with the exception that I steam doesn’t boil water. I think that’s what it is. And also, it doesn’t do popcorn cuz it’s steam. But out of those, other than those two things, a steam oven is a much more improved little appliance. But for those that do have microwaves, they’re often I would say most commonly in a base cabinet with a little trim kit around it. So, it’s treated like a little wall oven and that’s it kind of hidden away. And other than that, I mean, we’re still putting them in tall cabinets a little bit more elevated in height.

Jennifer-Lee:

Another thing I was thinking about kind of going back to the power topic was lights. I know some kitchens have a lot of pot lights because you need to be able to see what you’re doing, but I’m a fan of natural life. How much do you guys’ account when designing a kitchen to add natural light,

Katerina:

Every chance we get. I would say that natural light is something that I’m very passionate about. I came from a duplex into a house now in a duplex, you get like half the amount of light. So natural light is very important. If you have the opportunity in a renovation to take that existing kitchen window and grow it in height or width, I would take that up. It just does everything for our health and our moods and then the electrical, your pot lights or something that should be supplementing that natural light

Jennifer-Lee:

Catrina and Niky, this is such a great conversation. Smart kitchens are definitely making our lives easier. As we incorporate technology into appliances. There’s a lot more to discover about smart kitchens, including design and organization. But first we’re going to take a quick break to thank our sponsors.

Mike:

Measure Twice, Cut Once is grateful for the support from our podcast partners Fortis BC. Their support helps us share expert knowledge and resources like you’re hearing today from Katerina and Niky to help design and build the right kitchen for you.

Jennifer-Lee:

Speaking of resources, the BC Energy Step Code program is a provincial standard that is moving the entire home building industry forward to build homes to better energy efficiency standards, which means better comfort, health and safety. Be sure to check out www.betterhomesbc.ca where you’ll find a variety of rebates for construction materials, home, energy evaluations, plus mortgage and tax refunds.

Jennifer-Lee:

So, we’re going to talk about planning and we’re going to talk about the location, the home, where do you figure out where to put the kitchen in the home? Because again, it depends on where you want that natural light coming in while you’re cooking.

Katerina:

Well, there’s few things to take into consideration. I would start by looking at the, the box, the space that you’re you have overall. Be in a renovation that space is existing. So, looking at it as a whole entire area and maybe consider perhaps relocating the kitchen, if it’s current space is efficient enough, or if it could be improved. Now there’s different opportunity when you’re building from the ground up, you get to plan where your kitchen goes right off the bat. And there’s a few things to be talked about and considered. Niky and I worked closely on the layout of my space, and I want him to touch on like the energy efficiency of getting the galley style kitchen that I did in my space and how we chose not to touch any outside walls.

Niky:

Correct. So, going on that sense, when designing your layout there for your kitchen, you were very conscious about where you’re putting it in the house. So, her kitchen is actually not an L-shaped kitchen, that’s on two exterior walls. We’ve moved that away from the exterior wall and now it’s more centralized in the open space there, but you have only one side that’s touching the exterior of the house or the exterior wall. Now one benefit is to this is that with the Energy Step code guides that we’ll get into later on down the road we’re going to be wondering more about how to make your space more energy efficient and also to remain with keeping your air tightness numbers down. Now that is done by not penetrating your air barrier membrane that you have on your exterior wall. Now that is what we know as a poly or the white or clear vinyl that we have on there now. So that would have to be touched up if you put an electrical outlet or if you put plumbing fixtures or whatnot on that area. So, way to avoid that is either build away from an exterior wall, so that way we don’t have that problem or move that air barrier to the outside by using a VEC, instead of using a poly inside vapor barrier as your air barrier,

Katerina:

I was also going to say, so these things are considerations were in your building and renovating and some of that advice will come from your builder, perhaps your architect too. So, it’s very important to have those conversations early in the planning stage because it will affect your overall layout.

Mike:

Speaking of overall layout, you know, we’ve seen a lot of push towards open concept homes. One of the things I deal with on a daily basis is noise in the home and the transmission and noise. Thinking about that what are some of the things that you guys do when designing a kitchen in an open concept host to mitigate some of those noise issues and some of those issues of noise carrying throughout the rest of the house?

Katerina:

In some cases, we go back into a space and maybe introduce a wall here and there. So open concept is great, and I don’t see that changing anytime soon, but people are maybe appreciating that one, one wall being back in because it acts as a sound barrier. Maybe it’s giving you a little bit of privacy of hiding some of those dirty dishes while you’re entertaining and just leaving them aside. So, there’s a few bonuses to it. But when overall working in that open concept, you want to take, use materials that are perhaps absorbing sound. So that sound is not bouncing all over the place. There’s also smart plumbing fixtures, like one of my favorite things is faucets. A couple companies like Grohe and well, there’s, there’s a few actually. So, they’ve taken air out of the stream of water. So where typically when you turn on your faucet, you get that aerated sound. That sounds like this – ‘shhh’. And they’ve removed that air. The only sound that you’re hearing is the water splashing on your, the bottom of your sink, which is not that loud, that is giving you the opportunity to have clear conversations while somebody’s doing dishes. It gives you the opportunity to do the dishes while you’re entertaining. You’re not having to sacrifice dishes over conversation, or you want to watch TV and not have it on full blast to entertain yourself while doing these dishes, which is quite the chore.

Mike:

I have a quick question about wall assemblies and exterior walls. Now we live in a pretty temperate climate here, but we know our climate shifting it is getting colder in the winter and hotter in the summer, the way we’ve been building houses. Traditionally, do you anticipate problems with pipes and stuff on exterior walls freezing based on how we’ve built houses in the past, what would happen if we were had like three or four consecutive days of like minus 10 or minus 12, what would happen to some of these houses?

Niky:

So, I mean, if, if you didn’t have any insulation or you had a pipe that was too close up against the exterior sheathing of the wall, compared to being closer in, on the warmer side of the home, then you’re going to have problems there. So, I mean, in that sense, it’s kind of going to be what you had previously. You can’t really change much to it, but when we’re moving to these Energy Step Codes, we’re working towards ways of not having that be the problem by putting exaltation installation on the exterior, which we call escalation now. So, what we want to do is we want to mitigate the cold and moisture from the outside before penetrating through your sheathing, right? So, by having that exterior insulation on the outside of your home, what you’re doing is you’re stopping that cold air by having it already hit that insulation before coming into your sheathing and then coming into the insulation that already have existing in your home. So that would be a way that we’re looking to mitigate the pipe problem. If you want to call it that, down the future roads with the Energy Step guides.

Katerina:

My neighbor’s home is less than 20 years old. And through this last, cold stretch, she had to come over and use her like tap on the side of the house. She had no water for like almost two weeks. That’s crazy.

Mike:

So, Katrina, I absolutely love cooking in my home, although my kitchen’s not nearly as nice as yours. One of my favorite things is cooking on my gas range top. Now we’re, we’re changing, and things are changing in the city. And in general, what did you choose for your range top and why, and how would you advise our listeners to manage the decision they make to make the right decision as to what technology they choose to cook on?

Katerina:

I mean, you have your personal preferences. Mine is gas. I’ve cooked with both gas electric. I’ve done induction as well. There’s technology behind a lot. Um, it comes down to preference, you know, I love to barbecue, winter and summer. And then the same kind of, or similar flavor that you bring in from the barbecue outside. You can have inside your home with your gas, cooktop or range. I’m you know, passionate about my pots. I have a lot of cast iron pots, the cast iron, and then the gas brings a certain flavor into my veggies that I’m working on inside the home, not barbecuing outside all the time. So, to me, it was very important. I really had to balance and sacrifice some things in order to get this done in the planning phase. When we were thinking about this, I think the, the City of Vancouver changed somewhere along the way, but I was caught in an old rule where I had to pick, if I’m going to have a gas barbecue, a gas fireplace, or a gas cooktop, and I pretty much had to give up everything else.

Katerina:

Oh. And the in-floor heating was an issue too, cuz it could have been electric or gas as well. So very important cooktop. It was like, non-negotiable also non-negotiable was my barbecue outside. I did not want to sit there and deal with propane tanks, which is kind of ironic that that’s an option, but. I had to maybe give up the gas, barbecue. So, I had to give up essentially the fireplace. We have a steam fireplace instead and it’s really just for looks, it looks like fire, it gives you ambience. But other than that, you know, that was not as important to me. To me, it was very important to have to be cooking with gas. And not everybody would agree. I mean, there’s lots to be said about, uh, induction cooking, but yeah.

Mike:

Did the decision to use gas change your very insulation needs and what kind of hood fan and, and how you took care of the air quality in your home?

Katerina:

Absolutely. You do have to step it up with the CFMs on your hood fan when it comes to gas. There, there’s more in the planning as to what your mounting Heights between your cooktop, your cooking surface and your hood fan. That range is also to be taken in consideration, but using good appliances, um, will make a difference as well.

Niky:

Yeah. I mean, most of them already come with recommendations anyways, on what Heights they want from the manufacturer. So, it’s just these staying within those, but then the, like you were saying for the air quality, obviously bumping up those CFMs, but then also looking at if you’re not taking out too much air from the home. Right. So that’s one thing they’re also taking consideration as well.

Katerina:

Yeah. And that’s where giving the right budget for certain appliances or key areas in your renovation or your new build is very important. I mean, I knew I wanted to have gas. I cook a lot and I wanted a good hood fan that didn’t sound like, you know, an airplane taking off, two or three times a day when I’m using my cooktop.

Jennifer-Lee:

Other things that we think about when we are in the kitchen, of course, as a design, we touched a little bit about it, but a lot of the trends now too, is you’re hiding a lot of the bigger appliances. So, like if you have a fridge, you can have paneling on it. Are you seeing where people pick that up or are you seeing a lot more people wanting to show off their fancy appliances?

Katerina:

I encourage the paneling of the fridge specifically almost to all clients. It does force you into a certain price point. You’re at the mid to higher end for appliances, although there or fridges specifically, although there are a few inexpensive fridges to look at now. I believe that we’re living in smaller quarters these days in our real estate. So, to panel a fridge, which is a big appliance, I would say is smart because it gives you this continuous look of millwork and you’re not getting that break between millwork color and stainless steel. So, I encourage it all the time between a dishwasher and a fridge almost always.

Jennifer-Lee:

And this kind of goes with future proofing your home because too, like if you like the look of it now, then obviously it’s going to continue and be like a good resale value as well. You don’t want to be like, oh, okay, well, why didn’t I do that sooner?

Katerina:

Yeah, absolutely. And there’s a lot to be said about when you buy this, this paneled ready appliance and it’s forcing you into like the mid-high range of price points in the appliance world. Well, just recently I have got two current projects where we’re re are reusing their subzero fridge that’s been previously paneled now, we’re renovating, changing the look, but that same fridge is staying in there and it’s, it’s outlasted a 15-year kitchen already. And it’s going into its next, you know, five, 10 years.

Mike:

Styles change, formats, change what people like change. So how, how, when you design a kitchen, do you future proof it so that I can update elements of it to match current styles as I age out in my own home?

Katerina:

Well, I think there are things that don’t change. Your family needs are custom to your family and your home’s needs are also custom to your family. And then the trick to that would then be taking those needs and introducing it into a timeless design. If you can achieve a timeless design, it’s going to last longer than, you know, certain trends. So that’s important. And then you want to build and use materials that you can work with again, in the future, like the simple example of the Sub-Zero fridge getting rep paneled, same thing with the dishwashers, like where you don’t have to replace them in five to 10 years. That seems a little bit never mind 10, but five or eight years. It seems wasteful to do so. So, putting the right budgets in the right materials will give you an opportunity to stretch that out, both in timelessness, but maybe onto its next reno.

Niky:

And I think something to add onto that would be really focusing on your design layout. You know, if you’re going to be going through a large renovation, you want to be able to take in how to make this space be more usable over its life lifespan. You don’t want to be leaving something up that could have been taken away or removed something that should have stayed up just to be able to make something or save money or, you know, along that lines. But essentially what you want to do is start off with a properly designed layout. That’s going to be able to flow for the rest of the lifespan of your home, where you’ll be able to just be able to, you know, resurface your panels or, you know, resurface your kitchen, new countertops and stuff like that. Instead of having to go through a larger scale of renovation at each and every time.

Jennifer-Lee:

Well, thank you guys so much for all that awesome information. Katrina, Niky. Thank you for joining us on today’s episode of Measure Twice, Cut Once. Exploring smart kitchens is an inspiring topic, popular with homeowners. Who doesn’t want the best kitchen they can have. It is the heart of the home.

Mike:

What an amazing conversation this has been. There have been some great tips shared today. We’ve learned so much as an example, before you start planning your kitchen, go to an appliance store and identify your wants and needs taking in consideration prices to help you establish budget, work with your builder, to try to find smart energy saving solutions, to keep your operating costs down. When planning your kitchen, take into consideration surrounding walls, rooms and windows and plan like you’re a professional chef. When designing your kitchen, excess space is not always required. Spend more on appliances and fixtures you use every day, like your fridge and your faucet, and most importantly team with a good builder and designer to have your home built, right the first time to be able to take a few renovations down the road, you can do cosmetics changes versus structural upgrades

Jennifer-Lee:

And Katrina. Do you have one tip to share with our listeners, some final parting advice.

Katerina:

If I had to narrow it down to one, I’m going to make it a long sentence. I would want the viewers out there to spend the right amount of time on their project to give it enough in the planning stages and to also give it enough of the budget that it deserves.

Jennifer-Lee:

And Niky,

Niky:

When choosing a designer or a builder, you know, don’t, don’t let the cost be a factor. You don’t want to go with a lower price because you know, lower prices mean that corners get cut. But you also in saying that you don’t want to be going for someone who has a higher price, because a highest price, isn’t the best option. You really want to pick someone who’s going to be very personable and someone that you’ve able to look at their past jobs, talk to clientele, get testimonials and be someone that you would like to work with.

Jennifer-Lee:

Thank you both so much great tips. And I think we should all head over to Katrina’s place for a home cooked meal. This conversation is me thinking about food and you do make the best appetizers.

Mike:

<laugh> I’m in! Niky, best of luck. And Katrina as well with the upcoming awards. It’s really great to see fantastic people who are leaders in our industry, getting the credit they deserve. So, congratulations to both of you. To our listeners, if you enjoy this podcast, please follow and share with your family and friends. And the more followers we have, the more people find our podcast and the excellent resources our guests are sharing. If you want to check out other award winners and finalists, head to www.havan.ca/awards.

Jennifer-Lee:

And for notes and links to everything mentioned in today’s episode, including pictures of this amazing project, go to www.havan.ca/measuretwicecutonce. Thanks for joining us.