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Bobby Purba of By Design Construction and Alisa Aragon-Lloyd of Bridgestone Financing Pros understand the power of building your team when you are looking to buy real estate in Metro Vancouver to build or renovate. Listen in as Mike and Jennifer-Lee of Measure Twice, Cut Once learn about the importance of having good people on your team, to make your property work for you and maximize one of the greatest investments in your lifetime, your home.

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Alisa Aragon-Lloyd, Bridgestone Financing Pros

An award-winning 10-year member of the Homebuilders Association Vancouver, Alsia is Director on the Board, the Chair of the Supplier’s Council, is the past Vice-Chair of the Membership Committee and part of the Golf Committee.

Alisa Aragon-Lloyd is the go-to expert for all of her client’s financing needs. She understands the real estate and construction industry as a result of extensive and varied career experience with high-profile companies, including Polygon Homes, Ledingham McAllister, Pinnacle International, The Quigg Group and Hollyburn Properties.
After more than 14 years in the real estate industry, Alisa obtained her Mortgage license from the University of British Columbia and started her own business in 2011. She is the CEO and Financing Expert of Bridgestone Financing Pros (with Dominion Lending Centres Homeline Mortgages) after a successful partnership in Your Mortgage Solutions Group (with Dominion Lending Centres Mountain View Ltd).

Creating short and long-term strategies, clients come to Alisa for residential, construction, renovation, and commercial mortgages, and leasing of equipment and machinery. She also brokers unsecured personal and working capital loans that help them take their businesses to the next level.

Alisa has been quoted in several publications and is a regular contributing writer to the New Home & Condo Guide Metro Vancouver Edition and past contributor to Real Estate Weekly (REW.ca). Alisa gives back to her community by teaching high school students all about financial literacy.

Bobby Purba, By Design Construction

By Design Construction
By Design Construction – Laneway Case Study
Max Value Calculator

Bridgestone Financing Pros
Typical Construction Process
Construction Budget Sample Form
Financing Expert vs Bank
Home Renovations: Tips to save time and money

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Jennifer-Lee:

Welcome to Measure Twice, Cut Once a podcast from HAVAN, the Homebuilders association Vancouver.

Mike:

From codes to kitchens,

Jennifer-Lee:

Safety to sun decks,

Mike:

We’ll take you behind the walls and all things home building, design, and renovation,

Jennifer-Lee:

and give you the ins and outs from the experts.

Mike:

to help you build or renovate the right home for you.

Jennifer-Lee:

in plain language,

Mike:

focused on home building design and renovation.

Jennifer-Lee:

I’m Jennifer Lee Gunson,

Mike:

and I’m Mike Freeman. Now that you’re here, why not hit subscribe? And you’ll never miss another episode.

Jennifer-Lee:

Hey Mike, how’s it going?

Mike:

It’s another fantastic day Jennifer Lee, can you believe this is the last episode of season two?

Jennifer-Lee:

I know season two has flown by. We’ve talked about laneway homes, adaptability and aging in place, renovating condos, building duplexes, and just last week, the cost of building new with Shira from DOS Design Group.

Mike:

Well, I’m really excited about this week’s episode. Both of our guests are great friends of mine, and we’re going to take a deep dive and learn about how to work with numbers to decide if it makes sense for me to tear down my existing home, build new, or renovate.

Jennifer-Lee:

Ooh, I’m excited for this one. Yes, we’ve talked a lot about making the hosts work for you, but this episode is more about making your property work for you. And I’m looking forward to understanding the numbers too, because I’m starting to think about getting into the market, maybe to buy a condo. And I have questions around buying new or an older space and to renovate.

Mike:

Well, then let’s welcome our guests and make some sense out of these numbers.

Jennifer-Lee:

Today, we have Bobby Purba from By Design Construction Inc and Max Value Vancouver and Alisa Aragon-Lloyd of Bridgestone Financing Pros. Welcome to you both.

Alisa:

Thank you.

Bobby:

Good morning. Thanks for having us.

Mike:

One of my favorite things about co-hosting the show is learning about the backstories, the people who are guests. I love hearing the journey from where you were to where you are today. So before we begin, maybe you could tell us a little about your journey in this industry and how you came to be where you are today. And we’re going to start with you, Bobby.

Bobby:

Thanks, Mike. Cole’s notes would have it. I had a corporate job – planes, trains and automobiles, which wasn’t fitting any longer. And, I made the move into what the family business that was started in 1970s into real estate development investment and becoming a licensed builder about six years ago.

Jennifer-Lee:

And Alisa. I love learning about people as well. What is your background and what inspires you?

Alisa:

My background? My whole career actually has been real estate. I’ve been a financing expert for the last 10 years. Prior to that, I spent 14 years working for developers, such as Polygon, Ledingham McAllister, The Quigg Group, Pinnacle, Solterra and Hollyburn Properties that they own and manage their own buildings. So definitely, I have a lot of real estate experience, which is great. It really helps my clients and people that I work with.

Mike:

All right, well, let’s get into this and let’s talk a little about financing, home renovations and a little bit of the math and some of the things we might want to consider as we go down this road. Now I’m going to use myself as an example because I’m a prime example of someone who needs to be having this conversation. I own my own home. I’ve got about 10 or 11 years of equity in there. We have a mortgage, we have a family that’s not growing, but they’re growing up now. And this is a scenario which is common to many people living around Metro Vancouver. So let’s talk about my home and let’s talk about some of the options for me to consider because there are so many different ways to go. And some of the challenges that we face or sorting through all the different options to make the right choice, because the right choice has a lot of positive implications. Talk a little about my home and my scenario and what I should be thinking about and where I should start.

Bobby:

Sure Mike, common question. Even throughout COVID, we’ve been having safe onsite meetings on client sites, discussing that scenario exactly is how do we get more space? I’m in a similar situation where we’ve outgrown our space with the girls growing up and a puppy in the home now. And we’re considering our options on where we move as well or what the next move could be. So, Mike, in your particular situation, let me share a case study with you. Now, a client of mine, bought a home. In fact, I was looking at the same property near my home with the view, nice quiet street, good home built in the late seventies, about 3,700 square feet. It had some infestations, it was a boarding home, a bunch of different things there that we had to work through. We redid the drywall, we blew out some rooms. We renovated the bathrooms. You know, I think they were into the land for about $1.5 million if I can share some numbers. We pumped in about $200K to $250K. There’s probably about a $200K lift there. So if we were to list that property today, they would probably be putting it on for one nine, nine, nine, just under $2 million and outside of the kind of craze that we’re in right now in a flatter, more stable buyer-seller market, I think they’d still be making $200,000 on their $200,000 invested.

Mike:

Ok, I want to go a little bit deeper because you and I have had this conversation before. And at one point we were talking about new versus renovation and obviously some of the material costs have changed. How has that changed the nature of these discussions and the decision-making process?

Bobby:

Absolutely. So if we take lumber, for instance, we’re looking for new solutions on how we manage properties. Do we develop them now, clients are asking, should we push this off to next year? In fact, even some of the laneway clients that we have on our books, you know, Hey Bob, we might want to push this off because lumber prices, you know, three times above, we don’t really want to be doing that. From an overall material price or thinking about your home build versus buy scenario. Generally speaking, sharing some numbers, you know, a renovation, $150 to $300 a square foot, pretty wide range. Now, do we want to balance it off with alright, building, could we build depending on the municipality for $175K to $225K to $300K, so all around scope design, having your financier, your mortgage broker on hand to understand what’s the capability on this property, having a realtor on hand to understand what is the spec build for this? Is there an ROI for the client? Mike for your home. Absolutely. When we do sit down and crunch some numbers, I want you to realtor there. I want to have that conversation with him or her to understand what are the parameters? What is the scope here? If you decided to renovate it, stay for a few years, depending on what your mortgage broker may be saying, can you still make a margin on it or do we want to up that build costs, rental costs, and just stay and live comfortably and just age in place there with the kids and three dogs.

Alisa:

Bobby, you bring a very important point because what is the value of the home, right? Ultimately the lender, when you’re looking at financing or doing a new construction, they will see what will be the cost once it’s completed, not what the cost is now, plus the renovations or the built, right? So what is going to be the finished cost? So then yes, the realtor will actually help us kind of give us a sense of idea, but ultimately the lender will actually use the appraised value, once the home is completed to determine how much they’re going to lend.

Bobby:

Absolutely. So as built or as completed appraisal, working with a team approach, as we’ve spoken about for Mike is really critical, engaging us early, so we can set you up for success, right from the start. So we can work with my interior designer and we can give you the upgrades and spend on the kitchen or the outdoor barbecue and get your home, the lifestyle that you like. But we need that type of appraisal type of scenario where we are today. Where can we get the lending to, how does that affect your cashflow every month? Because that’s absolutely critical with the expense of living in the Lower Mainland and surrounding areas. So we don’t want to have that risk element where we’ve done a beautiful reno. We didn’t have the conversation with the financier, and now we’re in a situation of affordability.

Jennifer-Lee:

Well, not only that too, it’s also knowing what you can and cannot do on the land because a lot of people have this misconception is like, Oh, I can build a duplex in every municipality. That’s not the truth. So working with a builder early enough to figure out, hey, is this plausible? Can I put a laneway here? Can I do a duplex? Like what are my options?

Bobby:

Absolutely so feasibility we’re constantly today. In fact, today from 3PM till 7:00 PM, we’re seeing three clients between East Vancouver and New Westminster. And we’re talking about exactly the feasibility. There are misnomers out there around some of these smaller buildings at the back of the home or the side of the home. And we’re helping people understand the differences between an infill sellable unit versus a coach house versus a carriage home square footage. And then every municipality’s a little bit different. So just to chime in on your comment, there is the misunderstanding that folks may have is everything is feasible all the time. Some of this comes from, you know, Vancouver made a great decision a few years ago, they made all lots that are RS-1 zoned, automatic, outright duplex. So no rezoning, they really sped up the path to having density quicker. It’s not as quick as we’d like for permitting, not like Burnaby four months, we’re still, you know, with COVID time, we’re looking at six to nine months, more like nine ish or longer for an outright duplex project. But that’s some of the clarity we’re delivering to our clients. And as we speak to them through the channels they come through,

Mike:

I think that underscores the team approach though, because you have to have the right people around you. I did a previous episode where we talked about duplexes and I was all excited because I’m like, Oh, I’ll just do a duplex. And then went home where I live. It has to be at least a 10,000 square foot lot before you can put a duplex in there. So that underscored how even a municipality, just a few minutes from here is a totally different playing field. And I knew where to look. But the average consumer, the average homeowner doesn’t know where to look. And that just means they need to talk even more closely with you because before they put that offer in on that place, before they consider doing that project, they have to know what they can and they can’t do. And that should affect their buying and where they choose to purchase.

Jennifer-Lee:

I think sometimes too, when people are looking to purchase and they don’t think of the builder, because they’re like, Oh, I don’t want to bother the builder until I know exactly that I’ve got the piece of land everything’s approved and now I can move forward to building. But you as a builder, Bobby, do you welcome people coming in and be like, Hey, I have this idea. I want to kind of live in this area. What are your thoughts?

Bobby:

So the importance of having the team put together really early on in, we named the company By Design. We’re all building, we’re all developing we’re, doing some value added activity for all of our clients. Irrespective of the space we work in. The company named By Design is because we build by design. We’re speaking by design early on in engaging clients early. We want to have your financing by design your interior by design, your construction timelines by design, your project, vision wish list by design early, early, early. Three years, maybe seven home shows at the BC Home and Garden Show. And at the convention center, that was one of the first things I tell the clients is. Look, ask me now, ask me often. There’s no dumb questions. So currently we’re out on the street, safe COVID meetings, having those conversations. Engage early. And still clients have this idea, like you said, is around, Oh, we’re not ready yet. We don’t have our plans. Well, do those plans fit your realistic plan? Is it achievable? We want to be there early on in to show you how you can get there.

Jennifer-Lee:

Always starting at the beginning is always helpful. And in the end let’s face it, will save you money. Sometimes can equate to a less money spent depending on how good your plan is and if everything falls into place.

Mike:

And I think he also underscored why we’d want to bring that team in early because it’s not just the design. It’s not just the builder. It’s not just the real estate agent. I know with what my wish list for my house versus what I can get approved for. There’s a significant gap. I mean, I had to eliminate the helicopter landing pad, the indoor pool, the grotto. And so for me, the first person I would think to talk to before we start going down, any of these other roads is the person who’s going to get us the money. Alisa. Let’s talk a little about that because that’s a really important part of financing. This, how is the market out there in terms of how easy is it to get a loan? We’re in a period of somewhat economic uncertainty, is it harder or more difficult to get financing for a project that we want to do now?

Alisa:

It’s not necessarily harder. You can always get the money. The reality is how much are you willing to pay for it because there’s different types of lenders. So you have your banks, you know, called the A lenders. You have B, B lenders that the ratios are a little bit higher in order for you to qualify. And they don’t require as much documentation, or they will use the alternative documentation that say the banks won’t use. And then you have your private lenders. That’s a little bit more expensive money, but it’s more based on the equity. So we would look at what is the best option for the client. However, like Mike was saying, yes, it’s very important to determine how much you actually qualify for because of COVID. And unfortunately it has affected a lot of industries like the hospitality industry, the travel industry. So lenders are actually asking for a lot more documentation than they used to. So, I mean, it is quite a lot of paperwork to get approved, especially when you’re looking at a construction mortgage. And that is when having the right team is really important from the beginning, because the reality is you can’t have a builder give you something, but you don’t know how much it’s going to cost or see if you can qualify. So you have to work together from the beginning.

Jennifer-Lee:

Well, you also said you can always get money, but how are you managing people’s expectations as a mortgage broker? Because eventually you’re going to have to pay the money back. And I think that’s the thing people don’t realize. And like Mike said, we are going through a time of uncertainty. We don’t know what the five to 10 years are going to hold. And so that we could see a big dip in the economy and we don’t know yet. So if you’re getting all this money and saying, overextending yourself, now you could be in trouble down the road, can’t you?

Alisa:

It’s a very important question. And that’s when I talk to clients, I say, it’s not only what you’re actually qualified for. What’s the maximum you’re qualified for, it’s what you’re comfortably paying on a monthly basis. So I usually give them two calculations. So based on that, as we started looking for new homes in your case, then you would actually see what you’re actually comfortable with. And we can always look at and revise the numbers. As you start looking at properties right now for you being able to qualify it. And that’s why, because rates were so low for the longest time. Yes, the government was concerned that people wouldn’t be able to afford the homes once they interest rates moved up. So in that case, the Stress Test was introduced quite a few years ago. And if you’re in cases of refinancing or taking equity out of your home to do renovations, you’re qualifying at the greater of the contract rate. So the contract rate is whatever rate you have or you’re going to be paying plus 2% or the greater of, which is the benchmark of Canada, and right now it is 4.79. So, the reality is, you might be paying around one and a half to a little bit over 2%, depending what you’re looking at. And then based on that, you’re still qualifying on 4.79. That’s not the rate you’re paying, but you’re qualifying at that. So that actually protects it. So when the government, if rates eventually move up, when they do, then people will be able to qualify. And then all of a sudden, not go foreclosure or not be able to afford those payments. So there’s a buffer there.

Mike:

Okay. So it sounds like if you’re working with the right financial professional, they can do two things. Number one, they can help you finance your project. And number two, they can help you mitigate your risk and almost serve as a financial advisor to help you make good decisions to lower your risk. Am I correct in that assessment?

Alisa:

I mean, it’s important who you work with. Absolutely. Right. And it’s not only like one of the things that a lot of clients seem to like with me is I have gotten a lot of comments about that I explain things of why there are certain ways and I’m like, sorry, you can’t qualify for this. It’s like, no, you can’t qualify because they qualify you based on this. Or if we do this strategy, then we would be able to help you do this. As long as you’re like, for example, we’re talking about laneway houses, coach houses, different lenders, use different percentages. If it’s to help you to help qualify the rental income, to help you qualify, right? So that we’ll use some of the rental income to help you qualify. Most banks only use, say 50%. I have other lenders they’re still fairly regulated that you can go up to 90% of the rental income. So you’ll be able to qualify for more by using a higher percentage of the rental income,

Bobby:

Great point. I’m going to just chime in here on fit, right? And one thing is around assembling the right team who needs to be a part of this thing. And then who speaks to speaks and walks the walk. So what you’re hitting there is bang on under the hood of my business is the right finance partners, understanding the economic rants that can make or break deals, whether you’re buying your first house with a rental suite of one bedroom. And how will that rental income allow you to get approved? So you can actually purchase that home beyond thinking about, okay, now what can I renovate that home with? So there’s these offsetting variables, leavers I called them whether it’s my architect or my finance person, there’s these leavers that they are have deep knowledge of. And as long as they’re plugged in and it’s a good fit for you and your communication flow on the knowledge they’re sharing and you get it, then that’s building a good team. So, you know, I can’t stress enough, engage early, have those conversations. And I think part of that also what Jen was talking about earlier is you got to ask yourself those tough questions of the wish list and the need and the want. And I feel that some folks are really hesitating that. So they bring the builder or the, or the banker in late in the game, and now they’re already set their heart on. I have to have that kitchen. I have to have that stove. The floor has to be X, right? So having that self-conversation, looking at yourself, difficult conversation with your spouse or other half, whatever the arrangement is, do it, do it now, do it early. There’s always going to be opportunity in real estate. My father was always telling me as a young kid and still to reminds me at 80 years old, you know, there’s always opportunities, make sure you’re making the right decisions, have those conversations, build those spreadsheets and make sure it’s a good fit of who you’re working with. So back to the economic rants and kind of fiscal policy, you know, we’re looking at putting some large dollars out and you know, our concern is around how are we going to get approved on this thing? And how long are we going to hold it? And how will the rents be factored in whether it’s two houses being assembled or three or four, we need to figure out the economic rents here. So, you know, we need to have that conversation probably today. Fiscal policy, what’s the government going to be doing? We’re uncertain at this point. But you know, the expectation is that there could be some changes coming down the pike here because the market is really, really hot.

Jennifer-Lee:

Yeah. And I, I love what you said about like having realistic expectations because of course we all have wants and dreams and there’s nothing wrong with that, but you do have to have a little bit of like, okay, it, should I be doing this to like a hundred percent at the moment? Should I be like, you know, we need to take some things into factor, like you said, what’s going on federally going on in our own environment. And a lot of times, you know, we just want to look through all the pages of ’em or online now on Instagram and be like, Oh, I want that or house or whatever, but you have to have a talk with yourself. Like what’s important to me today and what’s going to help me in the future. And I don’t want to kill anyone’s dreams because I’m very practical that way, which is probably not the best way to be, but I just always like to know exactly what I’m getting myself into. And that’s why I like Alisa’s your approach. Because when I talk to other mortgage brokers, sometimes it’s like, they’re talking total different language than I am. And I’m like, I don’t understand at all, what’s going on.

Bobby:

So on that note, I wanted to actually ask you Lisa something around, you know, the commercial side of the business, right there is this other language and there’s this whole other speak. And for listeners who own properties that could be rezoned or assembled, this could be of good value is around the financing piece. When you’re looking at different municipalities and different council members and initiatives inside of those offices, the mayor office, for example, green initiatives, solar panels, these types of things. How do you look at those factors? Like which municipality is this project potentially in? How does that affect your lending?

Alisa:

No, that’s more for you guys because of the permits and for builders, it’s definitely more for builders because obviously the length of the permits, how long it’s going to take and everything else. And there’s different requirements, uh, with different municipalities, some of them are requiring different levels of Step Code. So no, that would be more you, a lot of them haven’t gone too much. Like I have a client, he just finished his passive home and he had to fork out a lot of money up front, especially like windows were very expensive and everything else. And that is why, again, it’s important having the right team in place. And that’s why I say to clients is like, don’t look at a builder, just like at the dollar sense, look at the relationship, how are they going to be involved? And they have to be knowledgeable in what they’re doing because the lender will want you to use your own money, whether that’s equity or investments that you have ahead of time. They’re not going to just give you the money right off the bat, right? So you’re using the equity or the, or your own funds first. And then once you get to a certain stage, there’s typically four stages in construction for financing, and then at that point, um, that will actually release more funds. And it’s based on how much has been completed in the home. So while he had to order the windows from Germany, you know, he had to pay a lot of money at front. Well, the windows weren’t installed. So even though he had to pay them ahead of time, the lender wouldn’t really release those funds until those windows were installed.

Jennifer-Lee:

What are the four stages?

Alisa:

So there’s typically four draws that they would do. One would be the lend draw, which will be the initial draw. So if you actually have your own property, then, at that point, there’s a certain percentage that will actually release. Then the next one is at the foundation. So once the foundation is built; then you have once it’s framed; then once it’s lock up – lock up me means all the windows and all like windows stores, the house is essentially locked in, right? And then you’re just finishing the interior landscaping and everything else. And then the last one is the complete. So usually in this case, what usually happens is people have tons of equity. Sometimes, most people might not even have a mortgage on it, but they have a line of credit and they’re like, Oh, I’m just going to use the line of credit to tear down the house and do the financing is like, actually, that’s not really the way to do it. Some people are like, Oh, well I have blind credit. You know, I have money available. And so the reality is the line of credit is secure to the house. Once you tear down that house down, the security is the land, right? And it’s not enough for the lender. So they could actually demand the loan. So you could be in mid construction. This lender actually finds out that you tear down the house, they can demand the loan. So now you’re stuck because you have to pay your existing lender out, usually think, and then you have to go and get financing in the middle of the construction, which is a lot harder to do. Like I mentioned before, we can always get you money, but how much are you willing to pay for that money?

Mike:

This is what I term, Mike, creative financing. Right? And there’s been enough. Time has passed and people still have the mindset that this is still a viable option, but the banks have gotten smarter too, because the risk for them is much higher. You’ve essentially taken a home and asset on land. Now the asset has gone, all you’ve got is land, but the equity that they were giving you, the line of credit was based on the home’s value. Plus the land value. The house has gone. Yeah. So your $300K is not $300K anymore. And you know, you may be in a bit of trouble and maybe you need private financing or you need some bridge financing.

Alisa:

Yeah, and so for example, I have a client that came and he had already started the renovations. I walked into the home and pretty well, like, you know, everything was gutted, so no walls and not everything else. And it’s like, okay. And they’re like, we need money. And I’m like, okay, at this point, we’re going to have to get you either. You could get the money to finish the construction, and then we can get you financing at the end, or we get your private lending, which we actually had to do. It’s a little bit more expensive. It does cost them a little bit more, but that was the only way. So it was enough money to get them to the point where they could actually finish the home. And then at that point, then we got them long-term financing.

Jennifer-Lee:

Oh, so much for you to think about Mike. I’m like, are you in there? I want to know what you’re going to do with your own property after hearing all this.

Mike:

I now have three to 500,000 more reasons to talk to the right team of people before I start the project. Because at the end of the day, and we talk about this in every episode, it’s the team of people you assemble around you. Alisa has just given us a great example where something that’s very logical for an educated professional go, Oh, I’ll just use my line of credit could really end up hurting us and being significantly detrimental to our progress and our finances. So to me, an ounce of prevention is worth $300,000 worth of cure.

Alisa:

And just to mention with the construction financing, it’s a very different type of financing. It’s not like you go to the bank, well, you to go to a lender, but I mean, it’s not that okay, you just get a rate for five years and then whether it’s a variable or fixed, and then you’re set. No, construction loans are very different. Not a lot of people understand how to do them because there’s a lot process to it. And again, you’re there through the whole construction, right? So you’re, and that’s why working with a builder that knows what they’re doing. It’s important because if you’re not at the right stages with the builder, when the builder is going to require some funds or the next draw and the construction is not a certain point, then the client is going to have to find the money somewhere to carry to the next point, because the builders are going to, they’re like, they’re not going to finish the project if they’re not getting paid, but the lender is not going to give you money if you haven’t reached a certain point. Right.

Jennifer-Lee:

And it’s important, like you said, to have the right builder, put the right mortgage broker, because I didn’t realize when you’re doing it on a construction process, like you’re there through all the steps. So it’s important that you’re going to have somebody that’s going to do their due diligence and keep you to task. Like you don’t want your mortgage broker to just like piece off and not like peace out and let you guys handle it. Right. Like, so it takes a good combo between builder, mortgage, broker owner, and then the whole other people that go into the team.

Alisa:

Yeah. I can only speak up myself. I don’t know what other people do, but yeah, it’s, it’s having that, that team in place. Right. And having the right strategy,

Jennifer-Lee:

Bobby and Alisa. This is awesome information for people who own a home. I want to chat about getting into the market. I’m excited about that. But first we need to take a quick break to thank our podcast sponsors. So hang in there, we’ll be back in 30 seconds,

Mike:

Measure Twice, Cut Once is grateful for the support from our podcast partners, BC Housing, BC Hydro, and Fortis BC. Their support helps us share expert knowledge and resources like you’re hearing today from Bobby and Alisa to help you build finance, design, and renovate the right home for you.

Jennifer-Lee:

Speaking of resources, the BC Energy Step Code program is provincial standard that is moving the entire home building industry forward to build homes to better energy efficiency standards, which means better comfort, health, and safety. Be sure to check out www.betterhomesbc.ca, where you will find a variety of rebates for construction materials, home, energy evaluations, plus mortgage and tax refunds.

Mike:

There are also rebates for renovations too. Just click on the rebate search tool button on the homepage of www.betterhomesbc.ca to find the cost saving resources for your next project, or talk with your licensed builder or professional contractor. They’ll help guide you. Now let’s get back to Bobby and Alisa.

Jennifer-Lee:

Okay. So I’m excited about this one. We talked a little bit about what Mike wants to do. Now, it’s time for what I want to do. You know, in the last few years it’s been a lot of frustration, which I’m sure a lot of millennials like myself can agree. It’s hard. It’s hard in many different ways, for many different factors for all of us. So I’ve had a lot of different issues because I’ve had a down payment, but there’s other issues to go with it. So I think that’s the thing is it’s like, we all hear about this magical word. Like you need the down payment, but then you go to a mortgage broker and there’s way more things to it. So where do we start? Like give us a basic, like start.

Alisa:

One of the things that we would look at is what are your plans? What are you wanting to do? Yes, you definitely will need the down payment lenders social use, or look at your income because it’s fairly important as well as how are you going to pay for the mortgage? And they will also look at the property. So especially if you’re looking right now and stratas and condos, they have to approve the property as well. It’s not just, you know, they might not have an issue with you. You might be a great candidate, get a mortgage. However, if there’s an issue with the building that might not approve it, credit is important because there’s two ratios lenders will look at and one of them to qualify you, one of them is called the GDS, which is the gross debt service ratio. And that would be for example, property taxes, strata fees, the mortgage payments and heating. And depending on the credit, it cannot exceed between 35% to 39% of your gross income. So your income before taxes, the other one is called the TDS, which is the total debt service ratio. And in that case would be the GDS that I just mentioned. Plus, any other debts you have. So if you have any car loans, credit cards, anything like that, that would actually impact it. Right? And that cannot exceed more than 42% to 44% of your gross income. Again, right now you’re qualifying at 4.79, right? So you’re qualifying at a higher rate. So that’s the rate we use to help you qualify.

Jennifer-Lee:

So many questions because I, like I said, this is something that I’ve been on a journey in the last few years, but, and I don’t know, correct me if I’m wrong because I’m always curious, but it’s a question like how important is credit because you were talking about that, but like, I have a perfect credit score. I know a lot of people have perfect credit scores, but I still feel like we’re jumping through 20 flaming hoops to get approved.

Alisa:

It is. I mean, it is a big decision, right? And that’s why, and I tell my clients, ask, like Bobby said, ask us as many questions as you have, even if it’s the same question, 20 times, it doesn’t matter. You’re very good at what you do, but so am I right? So I will do, and I’ll explain things. So you feel more comfortable because it’s very daunting. Whether you’re buying a home, you’re building a home, you’re renovating, this is not your area of expertise and that’s okay, but that’s why we’re here. And the experts are here to help you and guide you through the process and explain it to you. So you feel comfortable and we’re talking about when is the right time for you to buy? Yes, interest rates are going to move up. Interest rates are going to be moved down. There’s going to be changes in the market. There’s going to be changes in policy and everything else. But ultimately when is the right time for you, right? Because things are going to happen, but let’s focus on when is the right time for you? I’ll still get you phenomenal rate with the best mortgage, with the best rates and best terms. But when is the right time? When Bobby was saying, it’s like, well, lumber prices are going to are really high right now. It’s like, well, the reality is we don’t know if they’re going to continue increasing. They might go down. Right? But if you’re going to wait until like price come down, like I had a client, like he was waiting for prices come down because he’s like, Oh, I just don’t want to pay too much. And now he’s actually buying a home. I just got the approval for him because now he has where he’s living. They’re going to sell the place. And he needs to find a home for his family. And he’s like, I’m tired of moving. So I am finally going to buy now, but he could have bought something two years ago. Right? So when is the right time? Don’t speculate on the market. What’s going to happen. I mean, that’s investors. If you’re buying for yourself, you’re building for yourself. This is for you, right? This is like, we really have to decide. And when is the right time for you? The rest will work out itself.

Jennifer-Lee:

I love that you said that because I have felt so much pressure in the last few years and I just have to shut off social media and the news, because at the end of the day, it’s like, I have to remember these people are not buying with me. I’m buying for myself. And I always tell people, I said, I’m going to do it when I’m ready. I don’t need you to pressure me to do it. And I’m thankful that you finally put that out there because I think a lot of us in the millennial group, we just feel so pressured like, Oh, we have to do it now, or we’re never going to do it.

Alisa:

Yeah. Things are going to happen. And yes, you take opportunities when they happen. Like, you know, there’s a potential change in, you know, policies like, well, yeah, let’s look at it now, if it’s something that you’re looking at doing now, like why, why wait, you know, six months from now, but he’s ready to do it now. Right. So yes, sometimes it, it encourages you to do it a little bit sooner, but it has to be the right time for everybody. Right? And that’s, I think I would say that’s with everything in life, like, yes, we do have a lot of pressures that come from other places, but ultimately you have to do what’s right for you.

Bobby:

We’re spoiled now with the internet. we are so click oriented or, you know, back in the day, a little ways back, they’d call it, you know, coin operated going, goes in coins and goes in. You pull the lever at the casino or whatever, have you, we were expecting things to happen instantly because we live in an instant life, right? They used to be one instant coffee before and now we’ve got Tassimo. We’ve got Instant Espresso with Nespresso, right? We were so coin operated too. We want it now quickly. And we get distracted with that. Distracts us from the reality that real estate is a long-term game. Real estate isn’t I bought this condo for 300. Oh, now it’s only worth two 80 or now it’s worth 500. And we’re going to see those fluctuations in Vancouver is a, an interesting market space for studies for the future generations and even for today to understand what’s going on here, but it’s a long-term gain. So if you’re looking at a mortgage of five years, think five years, this is a five-year plan here. So your purchase decision today isn’t necessarily detrimental. It’s only detrimental or fear and risk comes right to your face in your homes. Um, strong and hard that that’s a lot of money today. In five years, this is an asset that you’re paying down. This is a place where you’re building equity. This is a place where you’re upgrading your lifestyle. This is a place where you have great conversations and sit and, and meet people. So we get distracted because of, but I want the instant now. Tell me the answer, what that looks like five years from now, you know, but it’s a, a journey through real estate,

Jennifer-Lee:

But I think you just hit it on the head. I think people forget. I’m also going to, most of us are going to live in these places. And we forget about that because I think real estate is so glamorized in the last few years that people are like, it’s a quick buck. Like I’m going to do it. And I’m going to get my first home and ever my age group says, I’m going to do this and I’m going to quickly sell. And I’m going to make all this money. And that’s not the case. Like you said, it takes time. And I think that’s something that we forget. I don’t know if it’s just my age group. It’s like, we’ve forgotten our patients a little bit. It’s like, you got to live in it. You’ve got to maybe fix up everything a little bit. Like maybe you’re going to buy something a little bit older and then you’re going to put a coat of paint on it or something.

Bobby:

There’s a way through all the challenges that come through real estate. Like before, there’s always an opportunity to real estate, whether it’s what you own, what you want to own, where you want to upgrade to or downsize to is always an option.

Alisa:

One of the things too is like with a lot of clients, like, Oh, I want to buy a town home. Well, right now you might not be able to buy a townhome. And it doesn’t mean it’s for your ever home. You have to start somewhere, right? So you buy a place, you get into a condo, you live there for three years, then you sell it and then you buy, you know, a townhome. I have a client, they moved into their townhome probably, you know, seven years ago. And when they moved in, I said, Oh, this is your first home. You know, the next one you might be buying a rental property. She’s like, yeah. Right. And you know what? Last year I actually helped them buy a rental property. Now they have their townhome and they ended up buying another townhome in Chilliwack. It’s a little bit further, but they have now two properties. Right? So that’s the thing. It’s just like, it’s not a, your forever home. Another client, they have a townhome. They wanted to buy a house. Their kids are pretty well growing up. They’re like, you don’t really need more space. And they wanted to buy a house. And I said, it’s going to cost you more money, more, more property taxes, like everything else. And so what we did is we actually refinanced and they ended up buying a townhome, another townhome. So now they have two properties instead of having one big house because they don’t need the big house. Right/ So again, it’s, it’s just steps. And that’s why also two is about finding the best mortgage. It’s not only about the rate because on average people do something with their financing, whether they sell, or they do something every three-and-a-half years and life does happen. Right? Because changes. So you want to be able to have that flexibility that again, you’re not paying huge penalties by paying your mortgage out early or something like that. So again, it’s looking at the overall strategy and really like, you know, like you said is, you know, Building by Design is financed by design. Is exactly the same thing. It’s like, every person is different and it’s like, what is the best option for me? It’s not like here’s an application, fill it out and I’ll get you the financing. Like, what are your plans? People email me. And I’m like, I want to have a conversation with you. And I want to talk with you. I want to hear more about your plans. Like, what are you wanting to do? Right. And then I give the client options and then I’ll do what the client wants. Right? But ultimately it’s like, I’ll give them ideas that they did probably didn’t think of. Right. And those are strategies. Like, everybody can get you financing, but it’s not about the financing. It’s about the strategy. And that’s what I really focus on. And that’s what Bobby does with, you know, when he builds and he signs for clients.

Bobby:

Well articulated. I mean, that’s the whole big picture piece here. I’m so happy and uplifted, honestly, to hear all of that. We’re short-sighted can be short-sighted about a transaction. We’re very transactional. Go back to the coin operated example. We’re transactional with our realtor, we’re transactional with the bank teller, we’re transactional with the car dealership. We’re transactional with your iPhone purchase in your app. Everything’s so transactional. We miss the big picture and the big picture around financing and great case studies you shared with us. Similarly, there’s this knowledge holders, right? Traditionally the knowledge holders held in knowledge. And it’s been very tough for me to, to grow into this space, trying to figure out, Hey, I own my own home. How do I buy a house? Why am I 35 years old? And I only own one house. I should own two. How do I own three? And I had a finance background. I was a lender at Vancity for a number of years. And this concept I call convergence where Bobby was a software engineer and Bobby was a lender Bobby’s been around building, but it just didn’t dawn upon me until about well, 38. And suddenly I was like, okay, hang on a second. There’s all this knowledge. I’ve had to learn it all myself. And part of this team, building partner, building approach to real estate, investment development, whatever have you buying your first property is all around. Let’s share this knowledge. It’s not one person’s to keep. It will not be mine to keep after I pass on. And for millennials or gen X or what have you, there is building your team, having a larger vision? So I’ll share a quick case study. I had a client who owned a Vancouver Special home. They renovated it, lived there, had a few kids. And I said, listen, you’re worth about eight 50 asset worth today. How about I told you in 18 months I can get you a three and a half million. And it took many dinners, many bottles of wine, and a lot of numbers because they’re very numbers oriented, much like myself. So I remember very clearly having a couple of beers and I said, listen, let’s go get my laptop. And we drove to my house. We came back with my laptop and we had dinner and we talked, I said, this is the plan we’re going to, I’m going to show you how you’re going to keep the house you have here. It’s going to earn you four to $5,000 a month. Part of this payment here is going to go towards your new land purchase. You have X dollars in the bank. We’re going to do your land purchase first. And then now, you know, they’re probably worth three and a half. They’ve held both the properties. And I think we’re overdue for a conversation and talk about what their next move is here. And these are very conservative individuals, very conservative, but understanding the numbers and having the big picture, not short-sighted about the mortgage payment, the mortgage payment, the tenant, et cetera. So I just want to share that real quick. So thank you, Alisa, for bringing that out.

Alisa:

Yeah, no, that’s great advice, definitely. Right? And then in your case, Jennifer Lee, you mentioned that you wanted buy something and maybe, you know, renovate or do something because you might be buying a, little bit older condo or townhome. And there is a lot of people actually don’t know about this, but there’s a program that is called Purchase Plus Improvements where you could actually add the cost of the renovations into the mortgage. So that’s actually a great program that could benefit some people who want to do some upgrades and want to change the flooring. They want to change, you know, do some painting. Those kinds of things. I mean, technically you can really, it wouldn’t include the appliances because you can technically take those. But any renovations, like if you want to renovate the bathroom or anything, it can’t be structural, but it is just more like, cosmetic in some ways you know, like tiles and flooring and paint and, you know, adding certain things, definitely that’s a program that it’s a lot beneficial for a lot of people.

Jennifer-Lee:

I didn’t realize that at all. And it’s so cool because like a lot of people that I talk to, they just don’t want to deal with a renovation. They want to just buy brand new. And I think it’s also like, Oh, well how much money am I going to have to spend into this? But realistically, when you’re getting into the market, you know, sometimes you have to go into an older space.

Mike:

Sometimes you have to get creative. That’s the thing that I’ve taken from the last five or so minutes that conversation is I can go online and apply for a mortgage. That doesn’t mean that person is going to give me good financial advice, Alisa. We did work together in a mortgage. You gave me amazing advice. You helped me save a ton of money and that level of concern and ongoing engagement, you just don’t get everywhere. And that underscores the value of our team. But it also talks about the fact that there are creative ways around problems. Jennifer, you mentioned trying to get into the market. Well, I moved here in 2000 from Ontario where you could buy a house for $60,000. So I feel your pain. It’s never been cheap to get into the Vancouver market, but yet here we are because I listened to smart people who gave me great advice and had my best interest in mind. And I know you will when the time is right as well. And it’s just really great to hear this information. Are there any other creative ideas that you guys have for someone who’s maybe either entering the market for the first time or like myself is entered the market previously, but then foolishly had extra kids and now it needs more space?

Bobby:

For today. I think get pre-approved for however, that means what that means today. Cause that’s shifted a bit to go buy a pre-sale. Go buy pre-sales.

Jennifer-Lee:

That’s what I was actually thinking about. I’ve been looking into presales. Perfect. I’ll talk to you.

Bobby:

I know a guy or gal who can set you up for success. 100 percent

Mike:

What about rent to own? And I’ve heard that sort of kicked around a few times. Is that, is that a valid thing in our housing market here? Is that a viable thing in our housing?

Alisa:

It definitely disappeared for a long time just because of the market. Um, but it’s definitely seems to be coming back funny enough. On my way here, I was talking to a lender about a rental loan because I have a client that has their existing home. They don’t want to sell it right now. And what they’re going to do is they have they’re doing a lento, uh, sorry, rental own agreement with the down payment that he’s getting the lump sum payment from. because you still do a lump sum payment with the lump sum payment. He’s using that as a deposit or the down payment for another property he’s going to buy and he’s going to be renting his first home in the meantime. And then eventually he will sell it to this to this couple that is going to be renting his home for the next couple of years. And at the same time they’re going to be saving money. It is very important that, you speak to somebody in the beginning when a rent hone agreement is done because you have to pay whatever the actual market rent of the property is. Plus give them additional money that that will be going towards the down payment. So if the rent is $1,500 and you give them say $1800, that $300 extra will be going towards your down payment, you can just pay market rent and then not give any money and then there has to be certain specific language in that rent to own agreement that the lenders will actually accept for the people that are doing the rental and not the one that, not the person that owns the property, but the people that will eventually will be entering into the rent to own. And eventually we’ll be applying for their own financing because lenders do ask for specific language that has to be there and as well, make sure that everything’s registered the right way to be able to do that.

Jennifer-Lee:

Well, there’s so much stuff to think about. I never even thought of all of them. And then my other question is a lot of people during COVID have started their own businesses or are freelancing more. And I know that sometimes that can be a hurdle to getting your mortgage. Because I have a few friends I’ve just gone through this process and they said it was a lot harder than it was when they were working for someone. Can you talk a little bit about that?

Alisa:

Yes, of course. When you, I have to say the easiest way to get financing right now is yes. If you’re an employee and you know, you get paid a salary. When you’re, self-employed, it’s funny enough because you obviously have more at risk and you work, you work really hard to, to make an go and, and do whatever you need to do. In that case, um, lenders like banks, for example, credit unions and mono lenders that only work with brokers you have to have at least two tax years of, taxes in order for them to qualify you because then they ended up using your two-year average. When you’re self-employed, you need two tax years. And as well as they will look at, there’s two ways you can do it. One of them is income qualified. So you’re qualifying based on what you’re declaring your line. I guess they changed to now it’s like 15,000, line, or it used to be 150 line in your, in your taxes and now, or the other one is called stated income, say, okay, you know what? I might earn $80,000, but I have all these expenses. So I only declare say, I don’t know, $40,000 for example, right. Or whatever it is, then you’re actually stated in your income, um, there’s insurers that actually will approve those, those mortgages. Now if you don’t have the full two years, there is the B lender, which in that case they do charge a fee, the rates a little bit higher, but they will look at alternative ways to show your credit. So in this case, for example, we can, the lender will look at, say your bank statements for the last six months and seeing how much deposits are coming into your account. So then you can actually show it’s like, okay, this is the income that is coming. We would see how mature your expenses. And then from there you can actually get into the market. And I actually had a client a few years ago, which he had been working for somebody. It was the same industry. He pretty well left. He’s a consultant. He left and started his own business and he wanted to buy this house. And I’m like, but I don’t have the full two years. He was doing extremely well in his business. So I actually got him into a B lender for a year. So then it allowed him to have the full tax years. And then once he was done with the two tax years, then in that case, we went back to A Lender at the banks or credit unions mono lenders, and then got him a lower rate. And he gave me, he said, Alisa, thank you so much for helping me and giving me this option because if we hadn’t done at the time, I would have been out of the market.

Jennifer-Lee:

Okay. So we touched a little bit about pre-sales and I know that this is an option while you just mentioned it. And I’ve heard from people that it’s a good way for first time home buyers to kind of get their foot in the market, especially now, because there’s a lot of pre-sales on the market.

Bobby:

Right? So part of that is the inventory status. For a lot of folks there’s this eastward crawl where you had a condo in at a thousand dollars a foot in Yaletown and now you’re in Burnaby for $650 a foot instead. So, you’re competing against my nephew, just bought a place and had to compete for that is first buy that they’re going to move out and start their life there. But they had to go through multiple offers. They had to get their financing secured in the first place. But the other option for them was looking at a presale because there’s more units coming out than existing units. So if you have the leverage of time on your side, you’re secure where you’re living now. Um, whatever that arrangement might be, but you have time on your sides. You can wait for that pre-sale. Now from a pre-sales financing standpoint, that’s going to be a different gig and I’ll let Alisa chime in on that, please.

Alisa:

Yes, because lenders will actually not secure. We’ll give you a financing now. Very few do. And that would be something for the developer. Sometimes developers do have, um, different banks that will help you with the financing and then we’ll secure it now. However, it depends a lot on the builder. Like on the developer, not all of them offer it. And so that can be a bit of a risk because you won’t get approval right now because lenders won’t approve anything until you’re 120 days out or even secure rate. Right? So that’s one of the things you really need to look at the contracts as well because developers have started putting certain clauses that if you actually assign that contract, you would pay like a 2% fee on top of whatever the price is. So, if you sell it at higher and the, the reality too is like, again, it could be a great option, but you like anything we’re talking about today, you really need to analyze your risk as well because things, life changes. I was talking to a realtor, they bought a place, you know, she was single at that time. Because some pre-sales are taking five times, five years to build three years to build, you know, and then she bought a one bedroom place now, you know, she’s married, she has two kids and they they’re living in this place and it’s like 600 square feet with two kids. Do you know what I mean? So again, life changes. So you also have like, when Bobby was mentioning, he’s like, what are your plans in the next few years? You also have to see that when you’re actually looking at buying a condo, because if not, you’re going to have to complete on that condo.

Bobby:

So there are a couple of levers there from a presale perspective is I’m living at home or I’m living with a best friend. We’re renting, I’m saving some money. I have a bit of money saved. I pull up from RRSPs as a first time buyer, $25K that could make up you or your down payment to the developer. And then, based on the contract, as long as that reads appropriately and your lifestyle looks that way, then it’s like, okay, I have the option to move into this in three years to completion. If that doesn’t work out well, whatever the rent’s like in that area. So again, having that conversation early on in with your finance mortgage broker and understanding your numbers and cashflow situation. So you have two options here. One is I buy this, pre-sale then complete on it. Or I flip it, make a bit of money. Even if the developer takes 2%, maybe there’s some margin there after the realtor takes commission. But maybe it’s a developer’s realtor anyway. So there’s a few, there’s a bunch of pieces in there, but there’s at least two options in a pre-sale. One is you get to park some money you already have saved up, hopefully in your RRSP, $25 Gs, put that down on this, pre-sale continue your life. As it is, unit comes available, then you make that decision point of, do I move in based on how my life has shifted or changed or do I sell it?

Alisa:

The thing is if you actually do decide to rent it, um, when you’re buying a property, depending on the value I mean, you’ve put as little as 5% down, right? As the down payment. As long as the property is less than half a million and you pay 10% on the balance between half a million to like nine, nine, nine, nine, nine. Right. Um, however, if you’re looking at buying a property and you’re going to end up renting it, you’re going to have to come up with more down payment because you have to have right now at least 20% percent down payment, if it’s going to be a rental property, right? So, if your life changes and you can’t sell it until after you complete, then at that point, you’re going to have to put at least 20% down. Right? So again, you need to analyze all the things. And pre-sales yes can be a great option for a lot of people. But again, you have to look at what are the benefits and what are your risks in that time as well.

Bobby:

So contingency planning is what you’re referring to is in the event. I have three years now, how much do you have to save to get to that 20% mark? So my risk is hedged. So again, I guess, without getting into the weeds of it all, talk to your banker, build your team, get together, have the upfront conversation, ask yourself about the reality of what your reality looks like today. And the reality of where you’re headed to the next three years or five years when I was at completion is. Life will happen. But at least you can do some planning today.

Jennifer-Lee:

Yeah. There’s so many options I’ve even thought about. That was like, if I bought a presale, could I put a renter in it, but not even that even to get my foot in the market, it was like, if I bought further out, because I have a great place that I live in at the moment, I was like, would it be more beneficial for me to buy further out at a cheaper price and then stick a renter in there? So there’s just so many different things that I’ve gone over with people.

Alisa:

I mean, you know what a lot of it is, like, I know you guys talked in previous episodes about aging in place and stuff, and what’s happening a lot is I have another couple, they have a lot of, um, down payment and a lot of equity in their property. They have a townhome. And now they’re looking actually of selling that townhome, using that huge equity and buying a house with their daughter and their family. So then the mom and dad will leaving downstairs and then the kids with their kids will be living upstairs. Right? And then the kids, the grandparents will continue to be able to help with the kids and everything else while the parents are working. So that’s actually happening a lot more where couples are actually going together or close friends are going together and buying properties together. So it’s great. So again, it allows people to actually still get into the market and doing it or two best friends, they’re doing the same thing. So again, there’s a lot of options. Sometimes it’s just thinking outside the box of what we’re normally used to.

Jennifer-Lee:

Bobby and Alisa, this episode has been so informative. You’ve both given Mike and I and our listeners, a lot of great information to help us decide how to leverage our properties, to work for us.

Mike:

Oh, we’ve talked about so much this season about making your house work for you, but I’ve really appreciated the conversation we’ve had today and learning about how to make your property work for you. I’m going to summarize some of the things we learned today because there’s so much great information. I don’t want to miss anything. Number one, build your team early in the process, whether it’s financing, realtor, builder, designer, renovator, whatever, get that team in place right away. Number two financing is the first step to know how much, but also knowing how much you are willing to spend. So you can make an educated decision from a place of strength and number three, considering all options and determining your goal, and then engaging the right team of people to make those things happen. Bobby and Alisa, if you could leave our listeners with one piece of advice each, what would that piece of advice be? We’re going to start with Alisa, because we’re going in alphabetical order today.

Alisa:

Really do what is right for you. Don’t worry about what’s happening in the economy, what’s happening with policy rates or anything else. Do it when it’s the right time for you, because that’s the most important. The rest will work out itself.

Bobby:

Right on. So I would say, you know, live your best life, define that, have that difficult conversation with yourself and maximize your value in your life and this journey here, figure it out, get engaged early, build your team and know your team. Ask questions.

Jennifer-Lee:

And if people loved what they were hearing today, and I know they do. Are there any resources you’d like to share for our listeners or how they can find you if they have any questions?

Alisa:

Yes, absolutely. They can actually contact me through my website at www.financingpros.ca.

Bobby:

You can reach Bobby at www.bdchomesInc.com use our max value calculator to understand how we can help you maximize your property value and live your best life.

Mike:

Thanks, Bobby and Alisa. This has been an amazing episode and to our listeners, if you enjoyed this podcast, please follow like and share with your friends and families. The more followers we have, the more people find our podcasts in the excellent resources our guests are sharing.

Jennifer-Lee:

I’m learning so much about how to buy into well, this crazy market, so thank you for sharing your knowledge. The idea is an insight. I have gained that the season learning about buying and renovating the homes right for me has just been amazing.

Mike:

Oh, so true. Jennifer Lee season two is full of insight, knowledge from industry experts. I encourage everyone to download the entire season. Each episode has been informative, relevant, and it has something for everyone, whether you’re building new or renovating,

Jennifer-Lee:

Make sure you check out the podcast page haven.ca forward slash measure twice. Cut once for additional resources from today’s amazing episode with Bobby and Alisa. Anyways, thank you guys so much for joining us today. Thanks for having us. Yeah,

Alisa:

It was a great opportunity. Thanks.

Jennifer-Lee:

This has been Measure Twice, Cut Once, the podcast from HAVAN, the Homebuilders Association Vancouver. thanks for joining us today

Mike:

For notes and links to everything mentioned on today’s episode, go to havan.ca/measuretwicecutonce

Jennifer-Lee:

Follow us and review us to help empower homeowners like yourself to make the right decision the first time.

Mike:

Until next time, this is Mike Freedman.

Jennifer-Lee:

I’m Jennifer Lee reminding you to measure twice.

Mike:

And cut once.